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Eugen @Gargron

Is it just me or the position of "newer"/"older" buttons on public profiles is really annoying with "older" being on the left rather than right?

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@Gargron I prefer "older" on the left because older pages in a book fall on the left side. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

@Gargron ... that feels intuitive to me? ( with "older" being in the ( at least US? ) constitutional "back" position? ) 🤷

@Gargron it's just you. I prefer "Older" on the left.

But it's not that important anyway. Not sure it's worth changing it.

@rysiek @Gargron older goes on the left.
At least from a western perspective.

@Gargron Pawoo seems changed those position🤔

@Gargron For me older makes sense being on the left (like in books) 🤷🏽‍♂️

@Gargron (I don't know the whole context but IIRC it's possible to do infinite scroll with a non-js fallback..?)

(Just make the "loading more..." bar at the bottom also display Previous and Next buttons (updating them with the JS for if network drops or something), no?)
(Maybe even add the words "loading more" with JS, so it doesn't even seem like a Both?)
(Disclaimer I don't JS so like...)

But that's the thing right? The profile is like a book in reverse order. It's "older" but it's also "next page" essentially!

@rey @Gargron This actually kinda makes sense! Because "older" on the left makes sense in Western reading context, but it might be different for different cultures.

So perhaps it could be determined by the language of the user or the instance, or changeable in admin settings with a user setting override, or...

Well maybe this is complicating things unnecessarily, because the text labels are very clear. 🤔

@gargron Yeah. I expected it to be on the right. But IDK if that's because I've been trained by badly designed websites to expect that or if that's actually intuitive.

@Gargron I think it's not bad if the button is labelled "next" (and maybe page buttons on the bottom)

@Gargron actually it's "previous page" if the book goes LTR. imagine a journal that you keep writing in -- you don't fill pages RTL unless your langauge is RTL.

@Gargron just label it "next page". Problem solved.

@qwazix It used to be called that, people insisted on renaming it 👀

@Gargron ah, sorry didn't know. Just put a cat emoji then :-P

@Gargron Personally, I prefer when "older" is on the left. In most western books, the "older" pages are on the left too.

@Gargron Noooooo I need it to be on the left, just like "Previous" on webcomics. When "older" is on the right I end up going around in circles.

@Gargron Heck, even within European and American comics, when characters move from left to right it means they're going forward, whereas when they go right-to-left it means going back, going against the grain or pushing back against something or someone. This is deeply ingrained in the LTR reading order.

@Reinderdijkhuis But going backwards in time on the posts is not navigating backwards. You're exploring the unexplored. You get me?

@wxcafe @Reinderdijkhuis centered "show more" link at the bottom and centered "show more" link at the top (if not at the newest page), how about that

@wxcafe @Reinderdijkhuis because it trips me up. it used to be good and then somebody came and changed those two buttons around and now whenever i look at the public page i look at the wrong side because that's where i expect to see the button, and it annoys me

@Gargron @wxcafe I think I could get used to that but I'm not sure.

@Gargron @wxcafe @Reinderdijkhuis the past is to the left and the future is to the right and you are not powerful enough to change the basic laws of time physics

@djsundog @Gargron @wxcafe @Reinderdijkhuis No, what you're doing is uncovering more new (old) toots -- heading off into the unknown.
The "Newer Toots" button (where you came from) should be in some predictable position on the page --
the "Older Toots" button should be placed randomly.

@gaditb @djsundog @wxcafe @Reinderdijkhuis the "older" button used to be "next page" and "newer" was "previous page". its unnatural for next to be on the left, where indeed it feels like you're going back

@gaditb @djsundog @wxcafe @Reinderdijkhuis this is also enforced by the browser UI, where the browser's "back" button points to the left

@Gargron @gaditb @djsundog @wxcafe
Oh but I get equally confused when "Next" on something like Tumblr points me to older pages.

@Gargron I guess I do but on an emotional, intuitive level it doesn't work for me. I do experience going to older posts primarily as going backwards in time.

@Reinderdijkhuis @Gargron Will agree here - I see social networking as microblogging, with the newest posts shown first, and older, previous posts as, well, previous. 'Back'. 'Older'. On the left. Like my WordPress blog.

But! I think it'd be cool to have something like that localized - how about flipping them for RTL languages, if that makes sense to those users, for example? :D

(yeah, more work, I know. We <3 you, @Gargron )

@Gargron That trips me up on other sites too. Might make more sense if they had up/down arrows to match the scroll direction 🤔

@Gargron sidestep the problem and add infinite scrolling

@Gargron As long as they are labelled 'older' and 'newer' and not 'next' and 'previous', I don't care which is where.

@Gargron This reminds me of synaesthesia involving time. Everyone who arranges time spatially around themselves arranges it differently.

For me, the future is in front of me and slightly to the right, which makes no sense because you can't see the future, so it should be behind you, right? (The past is behind me and slightly to the left.)

So maybe you arrange time differently to other people. Perhaps it is related to how much we read paper books and stuff?

More: news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8248589.st

@cassolotl @Gargron

This (in my own way)

Also, having it on the left seems like it disupts the flow of the page -- I'm guessing that's because the time stamp creates a semi-invisible column

anticapitalist.party/@shoutcac

Here though, having it on the left seems OK (scroll down):

shoutcacophony.net/

The opposite seems OK here to me, though:

autistichoya.com/

I'm guessing it's because of layout, to my eyes at least. I've noticed it before, but didn't stop to question why

@cassolotl @Gargron yeah if you're going backwards/to older posts you want to click a left pointing button and forwards is right pointing for sure

@Gargron I prefer older on the left (back) and newer on the right (forward).