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I'm a technically-minded person but reading Solid's homepage and docs, it sounds completely incomprehensible to me.

I'm conflicted because I don't want to be mean to another decentralization project, but I'm just not sure anyone would care if there wasn't a famous name attached to it.

Why you would choose to use RDF in the Turtle format on the web, when there's JSON-LD, especially if you then go on to recommend using a JavaScript library to modify it, I do not know

@Gargron RDF in any format other than JSON-LD has basically no applicability to the real world, hence everybody lacking knowledge about it. Turtle didn't exactly make things better compared to XML >_>

@piecritic @Gargron XML is still a much more descriptive and expressive mark-up language when compared to JSON, which is a data format and not originally intended for data description with semantic meaning. JSON is more practical, but to fully realize descriptive, linked, semantic data, we need something more expressive.

@piecritic @Gargron XML itself wasn’t, but it was designed to accomodate semantic meaning through namespaces.

@gargron there’s a lot in Solid that’s there just because TimBL is really committed to his ideas of the semantic web. RDF/Turtle in particular, which is rarely a pragmatic choice.

@Gargron Funny story, I have been incubating an idea for some months and it's really similar to this, I wasn't aware of Solid existing. So I'll have to choose whether to continue or focus my efforts on helping Solid. I was planning on using OAuth + GraphQL basically.

In case you want to check it out these are the repos where I started tinkering:

noeldemartin.github.io/autonom

github.com/noeldemartin/kinko

github.com/noeldemartin/focus

@ElfLord @Gargron false. Donatello is the best ninja turtle. He has a stick.

@Sadrockman @Gargron I'm just kidding. It's Michelangelo because he likes to party. I can relate.

@gargron RDF is a major inspiration for cutting-edge triple-store databases like the Clojure team’s Datomic, which store entity-attribute-value tuples. Those are really cool, definitely a road not taken by the broader tech community so its not surprising that it seems a bit alien, but I’m excited about it.

However I’m not sure if RDF/EAV loses any of its expressivity etc. if it was coded in LDJSON instead of the native RDF format there. I think the encoding scheme is a minor issue.

@Gargron i intend to support solid web profiles in my project, but the rest is just as you say

@Gargron You mean like a famous dev or a celebrity that opens an account or something?

@Gargron I suppose the Semantic Web didn’t work out but I see similar ideas are still here in, ‘… separate their data from the applications that use it. It allows people to look at the same data with different apps at the same time.’

@Gargron

When I was doing the #ScuttleButt / manyver.se post for switching.social, noticed that one of the first people to follow the freshly-made Manyverse twitter account was Tim Berners-Lee.

He doesn't follow that many accounts, so perhaps this shows he is thinking about a Scuttlebutt-style social network?

@gargron @lnxw48a1

>Solid is written in Javascript based on Node.js

Also requires CLI access and runs as a service.

Rant
https://solid.inrupt.com/docs/installing-running-nss
Many steps involved in setup and running.

https://docs.nextcloud.com/server/14/admin_manual/installation/installation_wizard.html#quick-start
Upload single file, run file in browser, fill in info and click install.

This is how simple installing a socnet instance should be.

The whole "Your data is yours" fails when you have to have your data hosted on someone else's server. A simple install on a shared hosting is a socnet that the masses can can "one click" install with cheap, non vps hosting will truly free personal data from others.

I have yet to find any socnet instance I can run in a shared hosting environment and I have tried most that seem that they may play well.
/Rant
@geniusmusing @gargron I think part of that is that shared hosting has gotten more restrictive over the years. When I got my first shared hosting account, I could set up five subdomains with their simple installer. A couple of years later, I had to shut down two of the three subdomains because they claimed one Drupal install used all the allowable database tables.
@lnxw48a1 @gargron
I think things are swinging the other way (maybe?) here are my stats, I am also hosting 4 domains.
Subdomains
8 / 100 ( 8% )
Disk Usage
15.83 GB / 976.56 GB ( 2% )
Email Accounts
8 / ∞
Addon Domains
3 / 999 ( 0% )
Aliases
0 / 999 ( 0% )
Bandwidth
26.71 GB / ∞
MySQL® Disk Usage
382.46 MB / 961.11 GB ( 0% )
File Usage
255,244 / ∞
MySQL® Databases
9 / ∞
All this for ~$6/month(pay 36 months in advance).
At one year is ~$9/month (in advance)

Same host for VPS:
2 GB RAM
2 Cores CPU
120 GB Disk Space
1.5 TB Bandwidth
Starting At $29.95*(pay 36 months in advance)
A single year is ~$50/month (in advance), I know there are cheaper but it is still several times the cost of shared.
@geniusmusing Wow. Bluehost was $5/month (paid 24 months in advance). My first VPS was $120/year, so for double the price, I got as many database tables as I cared to manage; a choice of which distribution I used; the ability to use updated versions of PHP and other software beyond the distro's repos _if I'm willing to do the work to maintain them_; the ability to store files not directly related to a website, and as many domains + subdomains as I could host; the ability to use Rails, Node, Django, or even Tomcat if desired. I don't remember what the RAM and disk space were, but I didn't ever come close to using all available resources.
@lnxw48a1
I can do ruby & gems but not node, I can pick php versions from 5.4 - 7.1, no Django but Wordpress, Joomla & Drupal, they are heavy on php not so much python.
@geniusmusing Having said all that, just keeping up with the security updates of multiple stacks is enough to keep me from installing most of these frameworks. I've already got PHP running here, so I do not want some Node flaw to result in compromising the entire VPS. (It is basically a cut-down older version of a browser JS runtime, so I'm not wanting to run it unless it has its own VM or container.)

@Gargron I just read how WebID works and how Solid seems to depend on WebID. It make me think of the old OpenID but extend to data storage as well.

I have doubts, because I hosted my own OpenID and used it everywhere. It wasn't the smartest decision in the end.

@sirn Right now I'm reading the WebID spec and trying to understand how it's different to OpenID

@Gargron From what I understand it's basically a newer incarnation of OpenID that come with some sort of social graph built-in using Turtle.

Oh and it uses public/private key cryptography.

@hypolite Many services eventually started deprecating OpenID logins is one, another one is I need to change my domain once or twice and updating that for all websites were… not… fun.

Not to mention if you're used hosted OpenID provider, the most popular provider MyOpenID shut down in 2014.

@Gargron I still wonder if or how this is a solution to ad tech's parasitic thinking .... and what about encryption?

@Gargron it seems to me that this amount of complexity hurts decentralization. Geocities happened because it was easy to write html. All these new acronyms are already intimidating.

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