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Creativity is a skill that can be learned and practiced and improved upon.

Fight me.

@WelshPixie

Few points:

- What we talk about when we say creativity is often wildly different things.
- Breaking it into a definitions sound dreary
-But if we need to we can, mean time lets just FIGHT AS TRUE WARRIORS, HAND TO HAND, IT IS THE... Wait, sorry this isn't Metal Gear Solid.

If creativity is a judgement of a person's behaviour (c. didn't do what most would) and an assumption of what they're thinking (they've a c. mind) then it's possibly external perception, not internal skill

@Barcode In the context of the discussion I'm having elsewhere, it's about creativity in skills like drawing and music. After arguing that one *has* to have a natural affinity at something in order to be good at it, they're now arguing that creativity can't be learned.

MORTALLLLL

KUMQUAAATTTTTT

@WelshPixie

There are no creative children, only children that aren't because they're disincentivised from doing anything creative ('KEEP THAT RACKET DOWN' / 'STOP DRAWING ON THE WALLS!').

I see it as 'remaining creativity' from childhood, it's not something that's easily added or refined (it takes a lot of practice to achieve mastery) but it's something that can have large parts removed.

@Barcode "It takes a lot of practice to achieve mastery" - yes! Just like any other practice that requires skill. I think people don't think they're creative because they've never been taught how to approach creativity as a skill.

@WelshPixie

I suspect there's a combination of things:

- lack of inherent self confidence (sc people are self starters; so they'd either begin and just be assumed creative from the start)
- intimidation by comparing their current status to masters and the resulting demotivation (I'll never be as good as _). This is a common problem in starting anything new, famously creative or not (eg Weightlifting/Gym).

If creativity *is* something, I think it's practice of idea generation *and rejection*.

@Barcode yeah, absolutely that. I wasn't at all creative with my art when I started - and now I have several reference books, I keep a reference notebook, I follow hundreds of artists I admire on IG - all of them combine to give me a source of inspiration. But that takes work, seeking out new things and actively trying stuff. Intimidation is definitely a huge factor, there's a big 'what's the point in even trying' stumbling block that happens.

@WelshPixie

That's just it.

The Creative Mind to me is such a myth. You need resources, patience, a plan, often some kind of routine, realistic goals, to assess personal failings in a constructive fashion.

I think it's harder to find a discipline that doesn't value this stuff than a rare creative one that does!

So the result is giant misconceptions about creativity persisting.

I wish 'techniques to make steady progress over long durations' were on cultures'' 'Such creative 🐶!' idol altar.

@Barcode That's probably what it comes down to, yeah - the 'creative mind' myth. Creativity isn't what people think it is, it's not some magical spark or some divine gift that some people are blessed with and others aren't. It's bloody hard work, hehe.

@WelshPixie

Yeah, and it's even used as a bargaining chip AGAINST people who put it in. 'We'll give you exposure, what do you mean you want payment?'

From what I hear, getting paid on time as a freelance creative is trench fucking warfare.

Like, Sun Tzu tactics to manage your cash flow aren't unheard of.

@WelshPixie I would, but, I'm not creative enough to figure out a counter argument... :coolcat:

@WelshPixie I mean, I agree, and I'm not very good at fisticuffs... Maybe a pool noodle fencing bout?

@WelshPixie Yay! This is one of the core principles of Eric Booth's "The Everyday Work of Art," one of my favorite little books ever. Here, "work" is a verb. "The work of art" is the action, the praxis, the _doing_.

Creativity is something you can work at, not just the mechanics but training yourself to think differently, to be more open to change, etc.

@WelshPixie I will only fight you if we get comically large foam swords and we are overly dramatic about all of it.

@WelshPixie Alas, where once there was the seed of a budding friendship now there is naught but strife and malice! For you have wronged me for the last time and I must have satisfaction!!

Prepare yourself you knave, prepare yourself to know my just wrath as I make you pay for your myriad crimes!!!

@inmysocks *puts warpaint on cheeks, grabs spear - er - nerfspear* RAAAAAH

@DialMforMara For me, with my art, it's always asking 'what if' - what if I do THIS instead of THAT, what if I combine this with that, etc. And then that involves research and experimentation; trying a medium I might not be comfortable with but that's kinda connected to what I do, thinking about applying my art to different things - it's training my brain to always ask 'what if'.

@WelshPixie @DialMforMara
:D
How to get better at inventing things: invent things.

@Anke @DialMforMara Heh, kinda. But it's forcefully doing a thing until it stops needing to be forced and starts coming intuitively.

@WelshPixie yeah, if art is some ineffible magic they would need to explain why most of the great masters were selected almost at random and trained in glorified art factories. I just have no artistic skills because I spent my formative years learning useless trivia so I can say way too much about duck penises at parties....

@Capheind ooh yes, hadn't even thought about the 'art factories'!

@Capheind or duck penises.

(Actually duck penises came up in a conversation with a friend recently XD)

@WelshPixie Counter hypothesis: creativity is natural to all humans and present in all children; then forcefully unlearned in state schools by most. Some people retain it, some people re-learn it, some people forget forever.

@raucao Quite possible. I do think that very few learning establishments actively promote the fostering of creativity.

@WelshPixie This is easy to observer in Alzheimers patients e.g.: in later phases, when they revert back into a child-like state, they love painting and creating things in general (if you show them how). Even if they were utterly uncreative over their adult lifetime and would've never even tried.

@WelshPixie This is timely, I just spent way too long working on a difficult art.

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