wtf is up with this design pattern on web apps where there are huge text fields for username and password on the home page and so you type in your username and password only to realize that the button below it says "Create an account!" and then you have to hunt for the tiny "ˢⁱᵍⁿ ⁱⁿ" button in the upper right-hand corner in order to actually sign in to your existing account?
@nightpool the new-user experience is important, since every user will see it, but they only experience it once. I don't think there's at all a zero-sum exchange between ease for new and returning users (perhaps minimal tension, but having clearly labelled buttons for signup/login seems fine), but shoving a common workflow behind an extra page load (several seconds and a mental context switch) seems unnecessarily ungracious
@nightpool @martensitingale Do you know of any studies that look at the impact of such design on the fraction of users who visit the site and then are still active after say 30 days? My guess is that the impact is pretty small since the users who wouldn't spend even a little bit of time looking for how to register are probably very likely to just drop off after registering.
@nightpool If you just treat them as raw rates and ignore how you're achieving changes in the rates, then sure. But let's say 10% of users who visit your site register and 50% of those are still using the app after 30 days, so the funnel to 30 days is 5%. If you were to make registration automatic by just sticking a cookie on their machine so they didn't need to do anything at all to have an account, do you really think that would result in a 1000% increase in people still active after 30 days?
@nightpool @martensitingale i understand your underlying point but there has to be a way to optimize for first-time users that isn't incredibly frustrating for returning users. the two use cases aren't zero sum. also consider that i (and others like me) are less likely to even sign up for a service that obscures the existing-user sign in
@aparrish well I think there's a difference between "arriving on a site for the first time" and "going back to a site". retention is important and difficult to optimize for and deserves a lot of effort, but once you've literally typed https://mastodon.social into your web browser then like, you've already MADE the decision to come back.
as the saying goes, "acquisition happens on-site. retention happens off-site"
@nightpool @aparrish yeah, i....... also generally find this pretty irritating. ( especially on sites where, like, actually finding the log in part is difficult / requires typing in a different url. although they probably would rather you just ~stay signed in~. )
but, like, not irritated enough to, uhh, dooooo anything about it. 😣
(answer: because the only kpi reliably communicated to ux and devs is the number of new signups and they don't actually care about providing the service of the application as much as they care about hockey puck user count graphs and gathering your data for resale and sending you e-mail newsletters)
as in if you type your organization's email address and it sees the domain part matches an SSO integration, it redirects you to the SSO page
a click is a bit much, I agree. At least some pages still just let you tab
@aparrish I have like five accounts on CamelCamelCamel because it lets you set up an anonymous watch, but then if you go to sign in it gives you a little warning that it will create a *new* account, and I only see that warning after LastPass autofills and I click it and WHY WOULD IT CREATE A NEW ACCOUNT WHY
@aparrish I don't recall where it was, but someone last year I ran into an even worse version. Clicking on the sign in link would literally give you a new user form, existing users had to then click on a second sign in link on that form to get the actual sign in form.
I like the way that Crunchyroll (as an example) is set up with a combined sign up/sign in form. Fill out the left side to sign up, fill out the right side to sign in.
@aparrish As a UX person, I think there’s probably an elegant way to utilize the giant text fields for both login cases, and let the system detect a new sign up vs a login, then walk them through the (quick) sign up process, if needed, before passing them on to whatever they were trying to do.
Really, until the user is manipulating data tied to their personal account, login can be deferred until user authentication is absolutely necessary.
@aparrish thank you I'm glad I'm not the only person this annoys.
@aparrish This is an onboarding thing that some startup somewhere implemented first and now gets copied everywhere. It’s really annoying to existing users, but it’s designed to make sure the new users have the fewest barriers
Apparently, most people are reluctant to leave what we know and are familiar with, but quick to discard what we don’t know. So they get away with it for the most part
All they care about are numbers so they can entice investors
@aparrish Ugh, I hate that.
And, like, this probably works if you're running a service very specifically for tech nerds. The kind of person who Googles "facebook login form" every time they want to get in is more likely to create a hundred accounts than ever work this out. Anyone in between? Who knows. Probably lose a few.
I'm sorry there are too many replies and I couldn't read them all but here I am
I was impressed with a company who combined the form; the form would log you in or create an account if you didn't have one.
Except I noticed this by accidentally creating a second account. So there's that too.