Meanwhile, in Russia...
There’s probably no other species besides dogs that we assign human attributes more often to than cats. Arguably, cats probably get that distinction more often because they’re perceived as being aloof or independent (at least when compared to dogs)
I wonder what that says about us. Are cats really more similar to humans or is it the particular combination of behavior and physiology that appeals to us
@cypnk also their face features
@amphetamine Did we specifically breed features that appeal to us or were they already appealing and we only enhanced that appeal
I wonder whether ancient people felt the same way we do about cats
@c25l @cypnk @amphetamine
The wild cats that are closest to housecats genetically are also extremely close in appearance and behavior, and the biggest difference is that they're smaller. I suspect the amount of domestication going on is quite small in comparison to dogs.
@c25l @cypnk @amphetamine
I'm talking, of course, about the black-footed cat: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black-footed_cat
@enkiv2 @cypnk @amphetamine I have found it to be interesting, in terms of genetics. Attempts at dog breeding and cloning have been extremely focusable, but cat cloning often gives radically different phenotypes of cat. While both types of animal can be domesticated, it's interesting to think about the way that this fact alone makes it very, very different.
@enkiv2 @c25l @amphetamine If I saw one of those, there’s no way I’d guess it was still wild. The similarities are uncanny!
Or did the cats select humans that fed them and keep their fields and barns clear of rodents advantaging them in the evolutionary struggle? Did cats breed desirable features into humans? Do we love cats so much because we were bred to love cats?
@hairylarry @amphetamine Wow! That’s a deep philosophical rabbit hole that I didn’t even remotely consider. I guess in a way, we have selected for each other’s most beneficial traits
Humans have bread cats that are aesthetically pleasing, affectionate, and take care of rodents
Cats have bread humans who survived longer thanks to their affection and psychological sense of wellbeing and protection from disease-carrying rodents
@cypnk @hairylarry @amphetamine relevant to the discussion: https://youtu.be/xbBMVa2A68s
@hairylarry @cypnk @amphetamine Or are cats, rodents and humans all just being manipulated by toxoplasma?
All of the above.
@hairylarry
@cypnk @amphetamine
Seriously, toxoplasmosis affects the brains of rodents so that they are less risk-averse and are attracted to the smell of cats. Many cat owners also have toxoplasmosis, and it's been shown that it also makes the human hosts more careless. I haven't heard of a study about whether it makes them like cats more, but I bet it does.
@hairylarry @cypnk @amphetamine
Where there are humans, there are cats and rodents. Classic co-evolution. Now I'd like to see a study correlating cat ownership with how risk-taking a society is. Did toxoplasmosis drive human exploration, cause wars and mass migrations, spreading itself and its hosts around the world?
Isn't historical ecological evolution fun?
Have their been societies in the past without cats? Are there societies today without cats? Eskimos?
@hairylarry @y6nH @cypnk @amphetamine The domestic cat was domesticated in late prehistory and became widespread in early historic times; there was a period where it was recorded as an exotic novelty coming out of North Africa. It only came to the Americas with the conquistadors.
There are definitely indigenous populations that don't keep them, although I'm sure that all but maybe the *very* most isolated Amazon groups have met 'em by now.
@y6nH @hairylarry @cypnk @amphetamine The problem is that this line of argument is used by people who want to completely eradicate cats and prevent humans from owning them.
what the shit?
disclaimer: I have kept cats all my life, I've been tested multiple times for toxo and come up negative. I am not schizophrenic.
@cypnk @amphetamine The wildcat species domestic cats came out of look almost exactly like a generic domestic tabby:
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=african+wildcat&t=h_&iax=images&ia=images
@cypnk @amphetamine Set the bar for ancient. Is Pangur Ban ancient? Are egyptian cat idols ancient? It seems to be a recurrent thing.
It seems to me unlikely that we specifically bred the features that were appealing out of nothing, rather than just enhanced them, given the remarkable similarities between behavior and look between big cats and house cats.