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I don't think we'll see a federated Clubhouse or TikTok anytime soon.

The correlation between ease of content creation and the success of federated projects is clear, low-effort mediums like text or photos are much easier to participate in than others.

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And even then, you can look at the proliferation of TikTok videos on Instagram Reels as another issue.

You can have everything right, but first-mover advantage isn't something you can always buy.

I have to say though, I'm really impressed that Mastodon didn't adopt Fleets/Stories.

They could have, but clearly saw something that even Twitter didn't. I'm not quite sure what that was, but I think all mastodon users owe Gargron a thank you for sticking to his vision and not just adopting the latest "hip" feature!

The thing with Clubhouse and TikTok is that they rely to a large extent on recommendations. TikTok's algorithm in particular is just plain addictive, or that's what I was told (I don't have the app installed). And it's what contributed a lot to it's popularity. It's next to impossible have this kind of recommendation system in a decentralized network.

And IMO it's a good thing. Social media shouldn't be addictive. It's a tool to connect with people, and that's it. It shouldn't be a substitute to a real life (unfortunately it is for me currently, but well.....)

@grishka @dansup Not to say that TikTok would have no place in the Fediverse, but besides its implementation, I'd be a lot more interested in seeing how someone would approach making something like a Fediverse TikTok clone fit in. As far as I'm concerned, TikTok _is_ its recommendation system. it does kind of feel like a distilled version of what we're all trying to avoid, but maybe that's just me projecting

@dansup We won't see a federated TikTok because the core of what made TikTok popular is an advanced video recording & editing app and an advanced content discovery algorithm.

It is not enough to just create a server that accepts video file uploads and distributes them to followers and call it "federated TikTok".

@Gargron @dansup that's true, but for a start it'll be something. i mean mastodon also works without algorithms and for some reason people still discover new content.

@Gargron Yeah I agree with that, but I'd say its more than just the editing + algorithm. The onboarding is something else, not requiring an account to browse the feed is interesting.

It kind of reminded me of pleroma, used to think it was tacky they didnt have a landing page but maybe they are on to something.

@dansup I doubt the web presence played a role in the app's rise.

@Gargron I meant the app, you don't need an account to start browsing on the app or web.

Regarding video editing, they have a separate app called CapCut. IG has pretty advanced video editing too, but their Reels feature is full of TikToks, so IMO its more than just that.

@dansup Sure, I agree that's beneficial. Though I doubt they would allow browsing anonymously if they didn't have a good algorithm for showing popular content.

@Gargron @dansup anything minus the algorithm would work though?

Maybe we should all develop a universal open source algorithm library, since content at It's core, just works the same in anywhere else. everyone who's working on a social media/fedi app would be interested in contributing to that.

@YaYu @dansup Video editing is slightly more complicated to code than your typical text with autocomplete and image attachments that you see in fediverse apps. I don't think we'll see it from a fediverse developer without significant financial investment and a respect for what made the original popular. Not that I think TikTok needs to be added to the fediverse. I'm not a fan of straight up clones anyway.

@Gargron @dansup straight up clones really doesn't offer much value other than It's on fediverse. but my ideas for unique fediverse platforms are a bit ridiculous tho.

@dansup I think a federated Clubhouse could be a really interesting project to work on, building on both WebRTC and ActivityPub, but I also worry that it would be the final tipping point in the collapse of civilisation as we know it.

@torgo @dansup mumble isn't federated, but anyone with a vps and a minute of time can launch a mumble server. my dad said it's the closest to what his experience of clubhouse was like.

Daniel Appelquist, the real clubhouse didn't collapse the civilization... Not even when I made an unofficial Android app for it and got way too much attention.

Neither did skypecasts. Neither did "phone ether", which was a glitch in some Soviet telephone exchange equipment that caused some nonexistent numbers to work like voice chat rooms.

@grishka having been on Clubhouse for a while believe me – it's not a good place. It's not a good idea.

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