Ffs, if you're still searching through Google - please don't. There are DuckDuckGo, Ecosia, Startpage, SearX and in almost all cases it's enough. If you really can't find something, switching to Google search is one "!g" away in DuckDuckGo.

@dpwiz they exercise their power do shape the internet the way they want.
Forcing website owners to have Google Analytics to rank well in search? Done.
Forcing publishers to use AMP to appear in search? Done.
Using their huge advertising machine to promote The browser which ignores standards ad it pleases? Done.
Huge surveillance machine? Done.
Developing military drones? Done.

@charlag Do you imply that switching to alternative search pages is a most effective policy to prevent them from developing military drones?

@dpwiz @clacke all if them you can.
I think it's very, very effective to hit their most powerful tool and revenue stream. If at least geeks would stop using google and Gmail, it would be huge. If some normies would, they would be half dead.
Some day Yahoo seemed invincible.

@charlag @clacke I may do a moonwalk around the Red Square, I do not expect it would be helpful. Should I still do it? How to draw the line between "not the most effective" and "waste of effort"?

@dpwiz @clacke I think if you do moonwalk around Red Square it would be a nice protest btw. Beware handcuffs tho.

But that's different. We need to tell people to not use google: to protect themselves from surveillance and to not feed the beast.
Power of Google comes from scale. We need to continue developing and offering privacy conscious alternatives otherwise people will shrug and "well there's no other email, is there?". And they might just not know about it.

@charlag @clacke
I'm certain that my privacy interests are aligned with Google needs for exclusivity on the raw data. The incentives are laid out in such way that it doesn't make sense for them to "sell their users".

I believe by strangling Google we'd do ourselves a disservice and simply inviting Chinese giants to steward the world in the direction of their chosing. And you'll get even less privacy and more imposed "standards", simply by having a different culture.

@dpwiz @charlag "It's either Google or China" must be the hottest take of the month.

@clacke @dpwiz yes, now we've gone from "it won't do anything" to "if we don't support Nazis then Commies will come for your wife!" (figuratively speaking)

@charlag @clacke Yeah. As much as I hate the alienating "us versus them" rhetoric those are the stated goals and a race to AI is on. Whoever decides to stay behind would become an insignificant backwater.

When doing the "us vs Google" thing, you're going to alienate engineers who still have influence on inside. They *did* force the abandoning of military contracts. They at least care about strategic safety, unlike others, who need to half-ass everything to get to speed.

@dpwiz @clacke none of the alternative I proposed are from China or have "sold everything to get up speed". Wtf you're talking about.

@charlag @clacke I'm talking about disempowering Google you propose by suggesting switching over to alternatives. Even if the means are effective, the ends seem counterproductive in the long run.

@dpwiz @clacke I still don't see why diversity of private providers is bad. Thus blind faith in Google's best intentions already costs us too much.

@amiloradovsky @charlag @clacke I'd love to adopt ecumenism, but the other parishes seem even more sinful, depraved or powerless.

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@amiloradovsky @charlag @clacke I don't see it as feasible at the moment. I doubt *either* of the extremes is feasible and we need to seek more saner alternatives.

@dpwiz @charlag @clacke Agreed. Yet the monopolies are closer to the second extreme than a sane optimum.

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