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Surprise, surprise, Raspberry Pi 4 has been launched!

Faster CPU, dual 4k HDMI support, up to 4GB RAM, USB type C, USB3 and (finally!) no more bottlenecking the ethernet port over USB2: full gigabit speeds!

Also: same old price 😍

@fribbledom this might as well be the innards of a laptop.

@fribbledom
#hardware : I want to change components! right on repair! Not thus #digitrash

@majestyx
Are you seriously bashing openhardware raspberry pi with the right to repair argument? Please tell me you are joking.
@fribbledom

@chebra

@fribbledom

Disposable hardware is "good" because it is "open"?

is that really supposed to be an argument? #LOL

@majestyx
Omg you are not joking! Oops. You are completely missing the point of the right to repair movement. Please try to get more info before you start arguing with other people trying to convince them. I see you have good intentions, but this way you might end up doing more harm than good. And that's not what you want, right?

@fribbledom

@chebra
I have the #freedom to speak as I would like. I express myself clearly.

your authoritarian habitus is only countering with me!
@fribbledom

@majestyx sure, nobody can force you to be right. Though, you just lost your right to speak to me

@fribbledom good
I mean if they add a second Ethernet port it'll be much better but still

@piggo

Couldn't agree more. That's the one thing missing that makes me still consider alternatives.

@fribbledom
The necessity for opaque binary blobs to boot the thing is one of my motivating reasons to not really care for it as much as I'd like. It's so close to what I'd like to see, but . . .
@piggo

@vertigo @fribbledom @piggo Aye, me also. I'm more excited about the Rock chips. But, that Gigabit LAN and USB3 combination is very compelling.. if it were x86 I'd bite immediately.
As to two LANs.. can you put a second LAN chip on USB3 and get the throughput you need?

@fribbledom @piggo i want more usb3 personally. 2x is good but if it were 4x then you could bootstrap a cheap 4-bay NAS, probably.

@trwnh @piggo @fribbledom According to the blog post it looks like there's only 4Gbps of bandwidth shared across the 4 USB ports, it's still better than the previous Pi but it's not "full speed" USB 3.
@Arioch @fribbledom thats a good idea. I don't like dongles, but it'll work

@fribbledom Yeah... but still only MicroSD Card for main storage, no SATA interfaces...

And apparently they changed the general layout in such away that you need a new case (ethernet port changed position, new USB-C, 2x micro HDMI...).

But still an impressive upgrade and i'm already considering a usecase to justify to buy one 😁

@aslmx

Well now, the new ports meant they'd have to change the layout one way or another.

@fribbledom sure this was somehow imminent.

But i guess it also means a lot of obsolete case in warehouses and thus plastic garbage 🙄

@aslmx @fribbledom they mention that you can reuse the official 3 case if you leave out one of the panels and clip it a bit.

@moopet @fribbledom yeah i have read that after my comment. Still there is a gazillion 3rd party Raspi cases which do not feature a panel that you can simply leave out ;)

@aslmx

Let's point at the right people here. What you describe is a problem with prefabricating too many plastic products, not with the R'Pi changing layout.

@fribbledom

@sybren

Of course that is correct.
Actually I didn't mean to blame anyone for a "mistake", but just saying stuff got obsolete.

@fribbledom

@fribbledom Very much considering getting one of these for a play around on these cold winter evenings.

@fribbledom I've been thinking about getting a Pi for a couple weeks. Not sure if I'll be able to get the new one for a reasonable price in the Philippines though.

@joseph

May be worth waiting, it's certainly quite an upgrade from the previous model. Best of luck!

@fribbledom Just read about it. Looks very promising. Now we'll have to wait for the distri maintainers to catch up.

@RyuKurisu @fribbledom I know, I mean I can’t hook it up to a hub and get USB and video over the same connector powering it like I can with my laptop

@cinebox @fribbledom ah you mean it isn't a Thunderbolt-C port? Yeah there could've been a lot more improvements.

@RyuKurisu @fribbledom it wouldn't have to be thunderbolt, just provide USB-3 (or even 2) instead of just being a passive power input port

@cinebox @fribbledom I thought you needed Thunderbolt for video, that's why I suggested it. But I agree usb on-the-go at least would've been nice to have.

@fribbledom Wow i totally missed the news :o
I´ve been using one of those as my actual desktop for a while, but stopped because it wasn´t able to play video on raspbian correctly. It would be amazing to have one of these newer ones even if it was just because of the gigabit ethernet! It makes it a capable little server too ^^

@vancha @fribbledom Totally missed the news, too. I'm still using a first generation RPi as a tiny Samba server/MPD player, and another one inside a MAME arcade cab. Was about to get a version 3 for a new arcade machine, but may now just go with the newer one.

@fribbledom
Sweet! I wonder what video codecs are hw accelerated...

@aperezdc

Unpopular indeed 😂

What could you possibly not like about USB-C? Are you hoarding old power supplies? 😆

@fribbledom Well, I do have most of my devices with pre USB-C connectors, but that is a deliberate choice to avoid USB-C. There was absolutely no reason to change connectors for USB, and the way -C is designed it allows ports to have different capabilities (for example ThunderBolt being optional, or charging), some combos of cables and ports can fry devices (granted, it's not very likely), and I would rather not have PCI lanes wired to a general purpose connector that any random device may use.

@fribbledom The PCI-on-a-connector is ThunderBolt, basically. And it's terrible from a security standpoint. Imagine any “cheapo” evil mouse or flash drive being malicious and having access to the PCI bus... Definitely a security nightmare scenario!

@aperezdc

As you kinda point out yourself, USB type C is merely a connector standard though. I really doubt the Pi uses it for anything but power.

@fribbledom ...which in my mind is one more reason to keep a good old micro-USB for power, as it won't (supposedly) be used for anything else 🤔

Moving to USB-C seems like gratuitously making everybody change their AC adapters “just because”.

@aperezdc

But certainly we can agree that type C is the much, much nicer connector standard? Perfect size, can't accidentally flip it the wrong way round, fits snugly.

Yes, we're making a bunch of existing cables obsolete, but such is progress, and it's really a relief only having one charger in your backpack to carry around with you.

@fribbledom Single charger does sound nice, and currently I only carry one for the laptop, and charge the rest of my USB things using one of the ports from the laptop, which is very convenient given that everything I have has micro-USB.

I kind of hate that the coming of USB-C also has reduced the number of ports which can be effectively used in laptops: usually there's two, one of which will be used for powering the computer. Currently I have three USB ports I can use independently.

@fribbledom scarcity of ports is not only due to USB-C, I know, but it helped. Also it's amusing how hardware manufacturers will blame ports for being too big, when in reality they blame is on their lazy design teams and/or fashion. If Sony crammed a full Ethernet port (and VGA!) in their Vaio X years ago, anybody should be able to fit half a dozen USB-C ports, Ethernet, and audio jacks.

@aperezdc @fribbledom The main reason I hear as to why people prefer USB-C for charging is that apparently it’s too hard to get micro-usb in the correct position.

@tyil @fribbledom getting a USB connected wrong never happened to people I know, but that can be considered circumstantial evidence. I can definitely appreciate how USB-C is much nicer from a mechanical point of view 😌

@aperezdc @fribbledom
Okay so...

1) The PCI lanes are a part of Thunderbolt, which as you said is optional. There's also opt-in before a device gets DMA or anything fun. You can also fully disable Thunderbolt in UEFI.

2) The big motivators for the new connector were reversibility (both of the connectors and the ends of the cable), power delivery, and a sturdier connector

@aperezdc @fribbledom That is indeed a very unpopular opinion. Why though? Personally I applaud every adoption of USB-C.

@fribbledom Fack, I literally ordered a Pi3 last week. It's on its way right now.

@fribbledom is it good enough for a home NAS? Or should I find something x86 instead?

@Groosha

Well, it still doesn't come with a SATA port, but if you're planning to attach external USB3 drives, it may indeed be a viable option now.

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