Uhm, didn't see that coming (totally did):

The Wire messenger changed ownership in July, didn't really notify anyone as per their own privacy policy, and now belongs to a US entity called "Wire Group Holdings":

Not sure how I feel about that (totally do).

@fribbledom Is "Wire" going to change its name to "Wiretap"?

use matrix, run your own instance hosted at home, problem solved.

How secure is Matrix? Also does it have offline messaging (like Discord and WhatsApp) as well as instant messaging?

In the context of changing ownership there is no risk if you self host matrix best in your basement. E2E works in 1:1 and group chats and device verification prohibits key injection to read conversations. I use Riot/Matrix only and have all of my contacts on it. So for me it works.

@fribbledom Wasn’t Wire messenger a messaging app offering end to end encryption?


Indeed. It may still be a better alternative to most other competitors. However, I still find it a bit shady to "silently" move ownership to a different entity.

@fribbledom It should raise alarm bells, is the ownership transferred to a new entity a consortium or has a new one been registered.

Does Signal not also have its base in the US? At least Wire has self-hosting and federation on its roadmap; Signal is intentionally centralized.


I've more or less settled on #Signal, though I hope they eventually follow #Telegram and #Wire, etc, and enable use without having to disclose a phone number.

@galambborong @fribbledom I don't think Telegram allows usage without providing your phone number to Telegram, although recently there is an option to hide the phone number from people who have it in their contacts.

Yes I think that's right, but one doesn't have to disclose one's phone number - one can share a username instead. But yes, a number is needed to use it!

@fribbledom i didn't have this link before, so on wire site about page, it still showed wire gmbh in Germany..

@fribbledom poking about online it seems the Privacy Tools people had a thread about this:

Wire have just released a "Business Update": which seems to suggest they've got a US company for hitting up potential enterprise customers who want it local. Also they're apparently starting work on federating between Wire instances which could be interesting.

Not sure on long term implications and also delay on them writing about it feels iffy.

@fribbledom darn. i liked they didn't use stupid phone numbers

stupid Signal!

so seems Signal is the 'best' for the regular folk now. that's what i'm using with my wife.

@fribbledom Given that the only people using Wire are people who believe weird conspiracy theories about Signal, I feel pretty good about it.

@fribbledom In fact, one of the major proponents I've seen of conspiracy theories against Signal and Tor was a person on Cypherpunks who claimed to be Australian but had a Russian name and was always posting pro-Russian stuff. Make of that what you will.

@DHeadshot @fribbledom No, if the server is up to date, offline messages, multidevice and encryption work.

f. ex.


Indeed, and this is regardless of #XMPP's many technical merits. This is simple logic: all the aforementioned suspects are funded by “angels” who have made previous successful exits in the very fields of instant messaging. Just what does anyone think they're doing if not trying to pull the same trick again? The naïveté of some people is just amazing. 🙂


@2342 @fribbledom

> many technical merits.

And “enterprise” usage.

Sign in to participate in the conversation

Server run by the main developers of the project 🐘 It is not focused on any particular niche interest - everyone is welcome as long as you follow our code of conduct!