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Anybody else noticed that over the course of the 2010s, every new piece of hip new American English slang from the humble "yass qween" to the sophisticated "on fleek" has followed the same cycle of

- Being coined by black women
- Appropriated from black women by white gay men
- Appropriated from white gay men by white wine moms

@garfiald if not black women then black gay /trans people, yes. but otherwise yes this has been pointed a lot by black american people

@wintgenstein @garfiald It's weird to see black culture start on a journey of appropriation that ends on a chintzy wine glass in a store for middle aged white women but i've seen it happen so many times...

@garfiald Garf is the second worse than the third? Like genuinely is it less awful if one minority appropriates from another?

@Vqrxtvs Hmm well for one thing I dont think that this cycle is inherently *bad* even as it is. Like "appropriation" can mean a lot of different things and I think that there's a possibility for it to simply mean one group having an influence on the culture of the wider group that it is part of. Too much discourse surrounding "appropriation" seems to promote complete atomisation and isolation which uh, that's not the world I want to live in

@Vqrxtvs That said, provided that the "appropriation" we're talking about is both 1) coercive (a piece of black femme culture is forcefully appropriated) and 2) erasing (the origin of that piece of culture is erased), then no, one is not better than the other. I dont think that a model which simply puts "marginalised groups" in the same bag accurately describes our reality. In most situations, white gay men hold privilege over black women. Not in all of them. But in most of them.

@garfiald and that's when appropriation becomes theft? But if we're taking back a word like a slur were not really erasing the source so it isn't theft?

@Vqrxtvs Well yeah but that's a different kind of appropriation altogether, because it's an oppressed appropriating the language of its oppression, rather than the more complex structures at work in slang

@garfiald absolutely! I was speaking reductively to clarify the semantics. Thank you, I feel a bit smarter. :blobcat:

@garfiald
How do you see step 2 taking place? One party fucking the other and leading up to that foreplay and social interactions?

Couldn't it be some daytime television channel that broadcasts slang du jour into millions of soccer mom their homes?

@tybre75 @garfiald lmao why do you assume fucking is a necessary part of this tho?
yeah a lot of the language in question progresses specifically through the queer community (see: drag culture) so linguistic innovation by queer people of color spreads to the queer community at large, and then it's introduced to the mainstream as characteristic of ~the gays~ instead of having that specificity (see: drag race. you're not wildly off base there.).
which is basically fine because that's how language works, ofc the problem is when entitled white and/or cis people use it as a joke or a quirky persona and then turn around and talk shit about queer and trans people of color.

@garfiald well nobody can appropriate my slang because nobody can understand it... now have yourself a fraptuous day and remember to get your good oogies

@imani @garfiald Bernie Sanders supporters being derogatorily referred to as "bros" seems at least adjacent to this

@garfiald sir you're describing nearly all American culture

@garfiald I think if we looked back further there would be more instances of this from black culture, that is, being appropriated by white gay men etc. then moving through the zeitgeist to find its way to white women at the end.

@garfiald over the course of the last several decades it goes further back. A lot of whyt gay culture is just co-opted from their other queer family members n then sealed off by the more queerphobic cis gays.

@garfiald There may have been some middle schoolers in that progression, too.

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