Just putting it out there: if anyone ever wants help - debugging, problem-solving, tutoring, whatever - with the Linux CLI (bash/ksh93, GNU coreutils..., vi, emacs, sed, awk) and/or git, I'll help.
I won't make you feel bad for anything you don't already know. I promise. (Nobody ever should.)
I'll reiterate every once in a while. Boosts appreciated!
Just re-upping this offer: because being comfortable with git is a barrier to entry to many FS/OSS projects, and because I care deeply about lowering those barriers, I will tutor anyone who asks for help with git, and/or connect them with any mentor(s) they might prefer.
I'll do this while I put energy and work into making the tool more approachable, and into making better tools and learning paths.
Boosts gratefully appreciated.
@gnomon That's a very kind offer, and we need more of that rather than Stack Overflow-style competitive correctness.
The offer's open from me too, but would anyone want to accept ‘help’ from someone who thought it'd be a good idea to calculate GCDs using comm?
@scruss aha, I see that your madcap solution uses factor(1), perhaps I could interest you in an alternate source of primes,,,
@scruss oh, and sorry, I should have asked: may I boost your extension of the tutoring offer?
@gnomon ah, dc; I do like my RPN. Dad used to sell HP calculators.
Computers have got a bit quicker since you wrote that: my 4 GHz i7 did your dc code in about a minute, as opposed to your 7½ in 2004.
factor is pleasingly fast, while dc might struggle with big factors. It'll do them, just not soon.
@gnomon Hey I wanna learn to use git submodules better and use magit - do you use magit?
(Not right now, but this is a great offer to make, and I will take you up on it!)
@emsenn I do use magit, yes! It took me a while to get into it but I finally did and I love it.
@emsenn at your leisure, there's no time limit on this offer.
@fireglow just tending the garden - I've gotten a huge amount out of this community and now I have something to give back.
@gnomon would be nice to being able to ask you some things when the opportunity arises, can I email you or do you prefer other kind of way for communication?
@gnomon "being comfortable with git is a barrier"?
@lx "there is a barrier in front of many FS/OSS projects labeled \"must be comfortable with git\"", would you prefer?
I think you know exactly what I mean.
@gnomon Some quotes would have definitely helped me understand correctly the first time I read it. But now I understood.
@lx you're right, it would have improved clarity and I should have caught that in proofreading. Thank you for the feedback.
@gnomon Hey Ben, a very generous offer which I'd like to accept. I need to know git for my own projects!
@the_englishman fantastic! What's your preferred comms medium?
@gnomon I'm quite adaptable/flexible, what's available? 😀
- there's always masto itself! Not great for longer-form comms and only so-so for interactive sessions but it definitely works.
- if you prefer trading longer messages, email works! I'm comfortable sharing my personal address via DM if you like.
- I'm on IRC! 'gnomon' on Freenode, plus some other networks; if you use that mechanism I'll come to wherever you usually idle.
- if you prefer voice comms I can call you.
- if you have other prefs I'll use those!
@gnomon I'm on keybase which I've used & seems good. I'll share profile handle through DM
@gnomon oh, just found out keybase has an encrypted git!
@gnomon I understand local git. I'm looking for a way to understand the working method around public github and pull requests. Willing to read an article if there is one. I get confused about the whole thing where I have a clone, I put in my own a patch, but then the main project keeps moving, not (yet) wanting my patch.
@vollink oh, I think I can help with that! (At least the mechanics of it; I'm not qualified to talk about the personal decisionmaking factors that would cause members of a project to overlook a proferred patch.)
@vollink does masto work as a comms mechanism for this conversation for you? Or would you prefer IRC (I'm usually on Freenode and Mozilla at the very least), email, phone call, something else..?
@gnomon Masto is fine. Or email. On a bus now, so don't have access to chats or a noise-free env.
@vollink ah, understood, that's definitely suboptimal.
Ping me back when you've got, say, 20-30 minutes at a keyboard and we'll take it to DMs? Whatever works for your schedule.
@gnomon Can do!
@gnomon I'm finally home, but the hour is late, so I'm not expecting you to be around.
@vollink just getting home now myself. Long night for both of us!
Check in with you in the morning, work out a mutually acceptable timeslot? This is a priority for me so I'll work with whatever works for you.
@gnomon Sounds good
@vollink sorry for not pinging earlier, the day's been a little more wild than I expected. How's your schedule today? I've got a gap between now-ish (1630h local time, EDT) and about 1900h; then a commitment from 1930h to about 2100h; then I'm free again until about 2330h-0000h, possibly later.
Do any of those timeslots work for you?
@gnomon In about 15 minutes I'll be home. After that?
@gnomon I'm home and on a full system. ...If you are still around.
@vollink I am!
@gnomon Okay, should I start here? or DM?
@offication oh gosh, that's a very interesting question with no easy answer.
I think the most common _generalized_ problem I've seen is new git users getting by with a small set of memorized commands, then encountering a situation that requires an unfamiliar operation - a merge conflict, a project that requests rebases, a need to edit history to remove an accidentally committed password, etc. - which goes slightly wrong in a way that is not obvious.
@offication the user often (usually?) doesn't see the issue until they try to get back to the task they were trying to do in the first place, then it fails...
...then in order to figure out the necessary corrective action the new user is suddenly forced to learn all the terminology, concepts, and skills they had gotten by without up until that point. It's a huge task, it comes by surprise, and although there's value there it is not the task they need to do.
All too common.
Great idea! Although apprentices must really commit to it.
If they don't... Well, can't really blame them. It has to be a free choice, can't really force push it on them. There's a remote chance they already know some git and will fast-forward to the objects they don't know.
@signaleleven all too true! Merging new knowledge into their existing skill set always takes work. New learners often cherry-pick the specific info they need, but sooner or later they'll be better served by logging a few hours to get a firm and complete handle on some fundamentals, then grow out from there - sweeping out the cobwebs of surprises one dark corner at a time.
I think I need your mentorship, some concepts you joked about now I don't even know them :)
LOL... Uh... Rebase 😂😂
@musicmatze that is awfully generous of you. Thank you very much, I will do that. Do you mind if I also take note of your general timezone?
@gnomon Sure, I'm based in Germany (CEST).
@gnomon git is luckily very easy to learn compared to CVS, Subversion, and other older system, luckily. Most people can get started with it in a day or two. Same with Mercurial, which I actually prefer over git.
It is good though that we have people willing to teach the basics because one of the things that is so intimidating about programing is the build system, versioning, and other non-obvious stumpers.
That being said, I've broken git repos locally a few times myself!
@woozle cool, thanks for sharing those!!
@gnomon are you interested in hearing complaints about git from an experienced user of VCSes in general who has managed to learn git well enough but still finds it annoying and frustrating sometimes?
(Me. This person is me.)
@zwol heck yes, hit me!
@gnomon I would love to be better with git. Especially after trying to get the submodules working with my vim plugins yesterday
@Absinthe it's funny how several people now have mentioned submodules in particular as a point of frustration. You're in good company!!
Would you like to engage about that? What are your medium and timing preferences?
@gnomon sure. This is a fine medium and timing is whatever.
I have a problem with a bash script containing some sed (or awk, I don' t know how they differ)
Would you please take a look at this thread ?
It' s locked, my bad. But now it' s done. You should follow me in order to see it.
@AbbieNormal bit busy at $JOB today but I'll take a peek over lunch!!
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