its fucked up that the whole "new wi-fi standard thats going to be integrated into everything and allows continuous recognition and tracking of humans and objects in 3D space through walls" isn't something that anyone seems to really know or care about

technology is 'cool' yes, but i feel like bathing all human-occupied areas in passive radar that recognizes and tracks everyone 24/7 to create a volumetric heatmap of exactly how you are sitting on your chair right now... isn't really y'know... it

@jk recently i've really enjoyed reminding people that keyhole sats have like an 8-10cm resolution

@syntacticsugarglider at least you can have plausible-deniability peace-of-mind where you're thinking "i'm PROBABLY not in the stripe they're photographing at this moment"

@jk im in a profound and irreplaceable emotional relationship with the IRATEMONK firmware backdoor that is probably not installed on my hdd

@jk @syntacticsugarglider guess I'll have to start making sure I look on point from straight up and not only from the back/front/side.

@jk this is one of those things where engineers think about the immediate implications (better wifi) and not the long term consequences (civilian radar surveillance that rivals that scene in the Batman movie)

@jk I expect a massive surge in home WiFi-proofing products soon; like we saw with 'RFID blocking wallets' when contactless payments first launched.

Get started early with the wallpaper and baco-foil, I guess.

@jk the hell?? This is the first im hearinh about this and it sounds sooooo disturbing

@jk thx for the article, very informative, just...

fuck me sideways this is some dystopian sci fi shit. Very shook right now. :((((

@jk Like, this could be really cool if used for accessibility and stuff, but of course it won't.

@jk @tuddr I went looking for independent verification and once I knew the protocol name it was actually surprisingly easy to find out that yes, this is exactly what it sounds like. fucked up. looks like you might be able to keep tabs on the status of the project here. I'm not 100% sure but it looks like the tech isn't entirely in place and no regulators are going to approve it until at least January, at least

@jk new? pretty sure it’s just the wifi that everyone already uses and is already integrated into everything.

@jk ah, you have now posted the link- did not know they were going to add the sensing part to everything. what was currently possible is using special equipment to detect interior sillouettes from ambient wifi

@zens my speculation is that the new wi-fi standards, having shorter wavelengths, will be capable of much greater spatial resolution, but probably the range and penetrability will be worse, necessitating a local area network mesh thing where each room contains multiple devices (smartphones etc) which gather data from their physical area, then forward it to the router at whatever frequency can actually reach it

@jk well maybe it’s a good thing. instead of drones blowing up a whole building they can have self driving sniper bullets use the hi res 3d model

@zens i'm imagining a chuck-jones-animated bullet swerving to a standstill in midair, sniffing around with its snout, and dashing off through a doorway with a "peoww!" sound

@jk it’ll never suspect that it’s just hitting the high res 3d printed scale model of me

@zens @jk you can probably fool the tracking with a sufficiently chunky-voxel hat to make it assume you're way smaller than a person because your resolution is too low.

@jk honestly it’s hard for me to think of what else you’d need that high res data for. reccomending food when it detects i’ve walked over to an empty fridge? achieving the holy grail of profiles associated with actual people and not just devices?

@zens it'll just be a "thing that becomes part of a standard and gets incorporated into every device in some firmware blob or small silicon IP block and just kind of hangs out there, like intel AMT"

@zens to help with "something" the device will probably cache the data it collects in some way, for 'debugging' or something, until some murder is solved using the cached data, and the governments start mandating access to it

@jk it certainly won’t be used to detect when two people have been breathing the same air for 15 or more minutes. that would be too helpful

very convenient that 5g is now associated with deranged people who think it will control their brains, i wonder who stands to gain from that :thonking:

:drake_dislike: 5g conspiracy theories
:drake_like: 5g conspiracy-theories conspiracy theory

@conatus the real danger of 5g is that it will be possible to buy a coin-sized camera/microphone/<thing> for $0.05 and stick it anywhere, and there will now be enough bandwidth to handle millions upon millions of them


But think of the monetisation opportunities 5g provides:

The door refused to open. It said, “Five cents, please.”
He searched his pockets. No more coins; nothing. “I’ll pay you tomorrow,” he told the door. Again he tried the knob. Again it remained locked tight. “What I pay you,” he informed it, “is in the nature of a gratuity; I don’t have to pay you.”
“I think otherwise,” the door said. “Look in the purchase contract you signed when you bought this conapt.”
In his desk drawer he found the contract; since signing it he had found it necessary to refer to the document many times. Sure enough; payment to his door for opening and shutting constituted a mandatory fee. Not a tip.
“You discover I’m right,” the door said. It sounded smug.
From the drawer beside the sink Joe Chip got a stainless steel knife; with it he began systematically to unscrew the bolt assembly of his apt’s money-gulping door.
“I’ll sue you,” the door said as the first screw fell out.
Joe Chip said, “I’ve never been sued by a door. But I guess I can live through it."
from: Ubik by Philip K Dick

@jk love the near future where i'll have to live in a Faraday age

@jk existing WiFi already let's anyone triangulate your devices too

@jk I understood passive sensing from ambient WiFi as something to look into for security reasons, to demonstrate it's possible and perhaps develop countermeasures. It seems kinda bonkers to use WiFi for this intentionally though. Grafting this physical sensing stuff onto a family of networking standards... I mean, this is bonkers, right?

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