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Currently, there are two large problems in IT:
- hospital networks security
- workable videoconferencing for more than 8 people

Remember the time when we thought cache invalidation is hard? Quaint.

@hhardy01

which meetbot would you use? I find the landscape of options scattered and more than a little moldy in spots.

@rysiek

@codewiz @hhardy01 @rysiek

right.

we try to run from this fork

github.com/ProgVal/Limnoria

but it seems not to have the meetbot plugin, which gets grafted in from less maintained supybot forks

@rysiek and if you're working for a 21st-century company, even telephone conferencing is a problem, ...

@rysiek
>workable videoconferencing for more than 8 people

oh, you mean multicast?

@kragen no no, @wolf480pl is right. The only sane, working solution for large-scale videoconferencing would probably need to be based on multicast.

@pettter @kragen @wolf480pl because of bandwidth, people's expectations (HD video, etc), and available Internet connectivity (a lot of people are on mobile data, for example).

of course, one can have a client-server architecture that solves these, but where's the fun in that? Peer to peer, baby!

@rysiek @pettter @kragen
even if you have one central server running something like jitsi-videobridge, it's still an implementation of multicast.

@rysiek @pettter @wolf480pl If last-mile bandwidth is cheaper than data-center bandwidth, you can lower your total videoconferencing costs by spinning up a VPS at AWS; cellphone data is typically an extreme case of this

@kragen @rysiek @pettter
>If last-mile bandwidth is cheaper than data-center bandwidth

I think you got this backwards.

@kragen @rysiek @pettter @wolf480pl If the reverse (or what you accidentally said) is true, than peer-to-peer is the answer.

@rysiek @wolf480pl if by "multicast" you mean "IP multicast" I think the preponderance of the evidence is that it's not workable at internet scale. if by "multicast" you mean more generally a system, including, e.g., P2P overlay networks, where you send data and multiple people receive it then it's tautologically correct: that's what videoconferencing does. also, say, IRC

@kragen @rysiek

>if by "multicast" you mean "IP multicast"

No. I mean the abstract problem of multicast.

And yes, it's obvious that videoconferencing requires multicast on some level.

What I claim is that multicast is the only hard problem here. That when we solve multicast, the rest is easy.

@wolf480pl @rysiek Oh, that sounds reasonable. I don't know if it's true because I haven't tried writing videoconferencing software myself. I feel like there might be other important problems, like security, user interface, and graceful degradation, which may or may not be separable from "multicast" itself.

@kragen @rysiek
yeah but if you have one that works for 4 users and doesn't work for 8 users, it probably means your implementation of multicast is the problem.

@wolf480pl @rysiek It might also be that your echo cancelation doesn't consider a long enough time span, or that your CPU can't keep up with decoding 6 or more MPEG-4 streams, or that the UI makes it impossible to figure out who forgot to mute their microphone next to the jackhammer, or that griefers impersonating one another or sending that photo of the guy with the penis down to his knee aren't a problem in practice with only 4 people, etc.

@kragen
People gotta stop posting pictures of my penis on video conferences Tbh
@wolf480pl @rysiek

@rysiek There's a good open source solution for the latter problem: bigbluebutton.org - I've got an instance you can try if you want... supports ~100 in a room (maybe more).

@rysiek I've had quite a lot of online meetings in the last few days - no-one is using the video, they're all just audio. That change alone is a massive bandwidth saving.

@rysiek @hirojin @deejoe @yojimbo Interesting conversation - the multicast one. Also, I didn´t shower at that day. SysAdmins supposed to smell like a wild cat in prison while eating weeks old fast food right? :flan_set_fire:

@FLauenroth @rysiek @hirojin @deejoe I'm showering every day, even though I'm pretty sure my computer doesn't have an olfactory sensor ...

@yojimbo @FLauenroth @rysiek @deejoe blames toddler

but also, you're not supposed to wash your hair every day

anyway, last time i showered (yesterday!), i also managed to shave my second leg

blames toddler again

@hirojin @FLauenroth @rysiek @deejoe Yeah, I am washing my hair every day - but I haven't used shampoo for several years, so it's warm water. Works well enough for me :-)

@hirojin @FLauenroth @rysiek @deejoe One of the other problems in IT is the tendency for sensible technical discussions to become sidelined into hair-washing and leg-shaving conversations :-)

@rysiek deep learning is getting pretty good. why not take a single still of each participant and animate their image based on their voice locally. it’ll be hilarious.

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