@xj9@merveilles.town I've seen the harmful link. To be fair aside from walls of text about what shitheads suckless are, there's not a lot in there. The stuff down the bottom about uriel is why I asked KHM if he did the commit. I also saw a 9fans thread somewhere that explained why harmful is the way it is.

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@xj9@merveilles.town the ants stuff is new, thanks for that. The No nazis link doesn't really mean anything. The issue isn't "Is 9front made by nazis?" - it's more "How does a project even manage to get to the point where the concept of that question solidifies, then double down on it?" Nobody goes on FreeBSD's site and sees Auschwitz pics in the official docs so nobody asks the question.

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@stevelord @xj9 trying for a constructive response after learning a bunch in this thread (a new user myself)

freebsd is a product and 9front isn't - it's a community centered around a plan9 fork. there are injokes that can be seen as distasteful, but a verbal complaint from an outsider isn't the biggest sway. in general it's seen as a good thing if someone bounces off the surface level like this, because it can indicate that they weren't really invested in the project

@stevelord @xj9 i've only seen the community be supportive to people that show up in good faith and a genuine interest - the lead devs are jewish people of german descent, and i'm a dumbass, and it all works ok.

i've seen a lot more distasteful community dynamics right around here on merveilles - look at urbit for an example of implementing a tyranny while trying to present it as squeaky-clean ;)

@stevelord @xj9 anyway tl;dr: the surface level of things is only the surface level of things. this is important to some communities, and not to others. i see it like openbsd's "weaponized comic sans" but more extreme. i'm not a fan of the auschwitz pic but i still treasure the community around this software.

@dogstar @xj9@merveilles.town If only surface level things are visible that is all people will see. When something like that pops up, it blocks people. It's unreasonable to expect people to look past that image to prove their investment to a community that thinks it's ok to be there.

I spent a week in papers, taking notes on 9p, plumbing, acme, and internals. I was ok to submit updates to the FQA but there's no way in hell I want to be associated with *that*. Their project, their choice. My time, my choice.

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