@micahflee Really looking forward seeing more people use it and ditch Whatsapp.

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@tapaniraja @micahflee If only it allowed usage without Google Play, I would probably use it. (Telegram, which I don't regard as secure or private and don't recommend to anyone, is nevertheless usable outside Google Play).

@setthemfree @micahflee This is true. I would love seeing Signal on F-Droid, it needs to get there as well.

@setthemfree @micahflee Even though majority of people use Google Play so I understand why it's there.

@setthemfree @tapaniraja @micahflee Last I used Signal, it *was* accessible outside Google Play. Has this changed?

They even distribute the APK directly on their website, though I had to use a DispVM with vanilla chromium to actually get the JS to load the latest download link :\

@MichaelAltfield @micahflee Seems it is still available as APK. I think what @setthemfree refers to is that it's not available on F-Droid?

@tapaniraja @MichaelAltfield @micahflee Afaik, Signal used to require Google Play Services to run, but looks like they have changed it so it can now run without it:

Good news, thanks for pointing out @MichaelAltfield !

I will do some testing soon.

@setthemfree @MichaelAltfield @micahflee By the way, are push notifications also Google services? I think I heard that once.

@tapaniraja @setthemfree @micahflee IANA Android dev, but I do believe you're correct. And that was Moxie's defense for requiring gapps for so long, demanding that the community first come up with an alternative.

There's also microG, but I'm not sure how that fits into Signal or push services.

Most messaging apps support polling..

Moxie clearly doesn’t care about the long tail of free/open source users. Signal is targetted to majority of users that do also have Google Play installed.

As for push there is OpenPush for free software:

@wiktor @tapaniraja @setthemfree Awesome!

> Using FCM also requires the inclusion of the proprietary FCM client library into open source Android apps like Signal, Wire or even Firefox, which makes them effectively non-free software which cannot be distributed via the fully free F-Droid software repository.

I guess that's the blob mentioned earlier ITT preventing Signal in F-Droid.

@wiktor @tapaniraja @setthemfree

Oh wow, that OpenPush announcement was from last month!

Has anyone inquired/pressured Signal/Wire/etc about replacing GCM with OpenPush and gotten a response yet?

Are there any downsides to stripping GCM libs and replacing them with OpenPush?

You’re most welcome to try to contact Signal (I'd be interested in reading the response too). But given how, cough, cough, “open”, they were towards LibreSignal I wouldn’t hold my breath:

@wiktor @tapaniraja @setthemfree I'm still reviewing OpenPush's presentation at FOSDEM. Looks like it's still at a work-in-progress state. I guess it needs to be vetted in more open/federated messaging services like Matrix *then* we'll take it Signal/Wire/etc.

Sounds good! But I guess one can already ask Signal/Wire/etc. if they'd be interested in using it if it had feature-parity with GCM/FCM. Trying it out with a free/open service such as Matrix looks like a nice way to test it and polish before integration with other services.

@wiktor @MichaelAltfield @tapaniraja Tbh, after reading Moxie's comments regarding LibreSignal, I have lost all my interest in Signal. The same desire to control and dictate.

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