The full exchange between @rileytestut and Apple's Kyle Andeer re the Core Technology Fee, since the full context is important (and I see nothing telling me I can't/shouldn’t post clips from the stream, so… 
)
@stroughtonsmith I’m predisposed to want to get annoyed at all this, but actually, I thought that answer from Apple was pretty darn reasonable. Well, when taken at face value, anyway.
Unsurprisingly, @rileytestut handled his side very well too.
@caseyliss @rileytestut that's why I posted the video; it's real easy to get wires crossed with text
@stroughtonsmith @caseyliss @rileytestut I listened to it, and I couldn't find the answer from Apple, only "need to get this right", which basically means, they will change this maybe. Would they waiver 5 million or not?
@Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @caseyliss @rileytestut same. Nice words but no real commitment.
@ruisan @Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut If they don't have anything to declare, they're not going to commit beyond what was stated.
@caseyliss @ruisan @Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut Absolutely correct, but it also means they sort of half-assed their DMA proposal as I think this issue was generally recognized extremely quickly and Apple either missed it or chose not to care…
ehs @billvinson @caseyliss @ruisan @Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut my problem with this isn’t really the non-committal per say, but the assumption that the CTF is at all reasonable. If the CTF didn’t exist, these edge cases would not require consideration
@eb @billvinson @caseyliss @ruisan @Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut
That’s the thing - there’s a real argument to be made that the ‘Core Tech Fee’ is already paid for…by the consumer when they buy the phone & the yearly subscription fee to become a developer.
Imagine there were competing operating systems & developer toolkits on the iphone, how much could they get away with charging?
@jamesjm Exactly. The only honest answer would be: "We just came up with this fee to discourage everyone from trying to use alternative stores."
Otherwise it would beg the question: How many ruined lives Apple considers statistically significant then?
This just shows how far from reality some people are. The Core Tech Fee is Apple's invention, there's nothing special about iOS warranting it. No other OS would dare.
@eb @billvinson @caseyliss @ruisan @Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut
@jamesjm @eb @billvinson @caseyliss @ruisan @Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut By the way, Apple did get a question similar to this at the workshop.
"I mean, from our perspective, as we approach each new iPhone, each new iOS, we're actually building a brand new product and then making it as easy as possible for third party developers to take advantage of everything we've built into that product.
It is a massive engineering effort, incredibly complex, and takes an incredible amount of time."
@jamesjm @eb @billvinson @caseyliss @ruisan @Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut Here's the relevant clip, I didn't want to cut anything in the middle but it's the second question.
@sbeve @jamesjm @billvinson @caseyliss @ruisan @Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut thanks for the clip though. I hope eventually the full thing is released
@sbeve @jamesjm @billvinson @caseyliss @ruisan @Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut I’m calling bs. They don’t rewrite iOS from scratch every year. In fact, they don’t rewrite it at all. Everything is built upon layers of cruft dating back to NeXT. I’m sure there is a huge amount of work every year, but that’s needed to keep even hw competitive. Android does fine without CTF.
@Ciantic @billvinson @jamesjm @caseyliss @ruisan @rileytestut @eb @stroughtonsmith More importantly macOS does just fine without CTF as well and it also allows for distribution outside the app store and it's doing just fine
@sbeve @jamesjm @billvinson @caseyliss @ruisan @Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut obviously they’re just saying whatever they think will help with the regulators. They aren’t exactly known to be forthcoming
@Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @caseyliss @rileytestut
I listened to the response and to be honest, saw this as a non-answer. This very point has been raised by many people, including the podcast. It’s not an edge-case, it’s one of the fundamental cases. The fact that Apple managed to work through the individual payment options for each of the steps and didn’t consider the cost to free apps doesn’t seem feasible.
@Ciantic @stroughtonsmith @caseyliss @rileytestut The all-too-obvious answer to this problem is for Apple to say: "If you're not making money on it, we aren't either."
@stroughtonsmith @caseyliss @rileytestut I really hope someone would ask why does Apple feel they are entitled to charge this fee when the third party apps are partially the reason why iPhone becomes commercially successful 
:verified: @caseyliss @khaost @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut I get it…. But also they could be entitled to say without the iPhone there would not be those third party apps. It’s all a mess. Because everyone has a valid point to bring to the table.
@Actionscientist @caseyliss @khaost @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut But double also, 37% margins on $1500 phones. Apple is getting theirs, thanks to third party developers' software making the device look so so good.
No one wants a $1500 device with Calendar.
@maddox @caseyliss @khaost @stroughtonsmith @rileytestut not saying third party devs aren’t bring something to the table. We don’t have this information because we don’t have access to it but how many devices do run Calendar and other first party apps? (I do… I’ve tried the third party apps and I always end back there). What I mean is it’s a dangerous road to assume what we tech folks do is what everyone does.
@stroughtonsmith @caseyliss @rileytestut people read them with the voice they want it to be read with. Fat cat chortling, or a California surfer “whatever”.
It’s always a problem, and seeing the video helps us remember “we’re all ppl”, albeit with different goals.